Comments by P_Connolly
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Posted on February 13 at 6:54 a.m.
fehmi: Thank you for a most informative post. However, I think you have partially misunderstood ADL's stance on the issue. The ADL is refusing to label the 1915 events as "genocide". Other groups in Boston (primarily Armenians) - formerly allied with the ADL - have broken away from it because of the ADL's stance on this issue.
Posted on February 12 at 9:28 a.m.
The reason that the concept of forgiveness is relevant here is that these events happened over 90 years ago and the perpetrators are all quite dead. The Armenians have their grandparents' stories and the Turks have their grandparents' stories. Hearing these stories is troubling - more so when one contemplates the effect that these events have had on one's own life. Powerful emotions are generated by these events and stories. The way we react to these emotions is a personal decision and varies from one individual to another. For some these emotions breed deep-seated hatreds that ultimately find their outlet in criminal behavior or in nonviolent but extremely antisocial or highly unethical behavior such as lying, calumny, and deceit. Others struggle to overcome the tendency toward hatred, examine the facts impartially, and search for the real underlying causes of the disturbances that happened so long ago but continue to have an effect in the lives of the descendents. Armenians, both individually and as a community need to re-examine what has become of them since their ancestors came here decades ago and ask some serious questions about whether their response to these events has been helpful to them, to their host culture, and to the world at large.
Posted on February 10 at 7:10 p.m.
The Turkish position is that the deaths did indeed occur but that they did not occur in a genocide. Due to the seriousness and complexity of the situation and the number of Turks who died at the hands of Armenians (and the way they died) they are outraged at what some among the Diaspora Armenians are doing: namely putting this event in the same category with Hitler's Germany. Occasionally some Turks say "there was no genocide" meaning that though the deaths occurred, they did not occur in a genocide. They are not denying the deaths, even when they say "There was no genocide".
No one is suggesting that your grandparents made all this up. But neither did the Turks' grandparents make up their stories.
Regarding Suheyla's comments about being "banned": Note that "Suzy" had stated that "P. Connolly is a Turk hiding under a 'Western' name". In fact I am not a Turk nor am I related -even by marriage- to a Turk. I'm an American who happens to have studied Turkish History and Culture in depth. But how telling it is that my right to speak in this forum is being challenged because "Suzy" thinks I'm a Turk. If I were a Turk, should I be banned from speaking in this forum ? Should my arguments not be heard if I were Turkish and not truly American ? What possible motive could Suzy's words have other than ethnic hatred ? Armenians and Assyrians should stop to think about what is happening here. Both are Christian Peoples and the Turks are predominantly a Moslem People. Is it fitting and proper that you -as Christians- come here to the West making these charges, listening only to what you have heard from your ancestors and your leaders without due regard for the truth and without regard for the biblical teachings on love for your fellow man and forgiveness? Is it fitting that you should come here to your Christian Brethren in America asking for help in settling your old score with "those Moslem Turks" - an unsettled score from a war of nearly a century ago?
Posted on February 8 at 11:25 p.m.
Lets be clear: these self-proclaimed genocide "scholars" that the Armenians are so fond of quoting in support of their claims operate as a closed interest group or club. Impartial Historians report and uncover historical facts; the services of these self-proclaimed genocide "scholars" are not needed.
Lets be clear: The Armenians' claim that "no one doubts the Historical Validity of the Armenian Genocide" is nothing but a blatant lie.
Lets be clear: The Armenians' assertion that "23 countries do not doubt the Armenian Genocide" is deceitful propaganda. Legislators clearly have a vested interest in pleasing their voters; they are not elected to decide on historical facts nor are they qualified to do so.
Lets be clear: Nothing in the US archives can negate the clear historical fact that the Armenians couldn't have picked a worse time to collude with their Christian Brethren in "Holy Russia" against the Moslem Ottoman Empire which -after the outbreak of World War One in 1914 found itself surrounded on all sides by the armies of nations much more powerful than its own. Armenians need to stop denying the reality of the situation.
Posted on February 8 at 9:17 a.m.
The ADL isn't the only institution objecting to the "genocide" label for the Armenian tragedy of 1915. Unlike other genocides of the 20th century which the world has been slow or reluctant to acknowledge, the Armenian Tragedy is conspicuous for the number of reputable and highly qualified historians and demographers who have rejected the "genocide" label for this complex event. When the arguments of both sides of this complex issue are carefully examined, it becomes quite clear that the denial is coming from the Armenian side, not the Turkish side. Furthermore, the Armenian side is well organized and they have repeatedly demonstrated their determination to seduce our most vulnerable politicians with guaranteed deliveries of large blocks of votes in a desperate campaign to legislate their version of "the truth". These Armenian Agitators are promoting a disinformation campaign filled with lying propaganda and ethnic hatred against the Turkish People.
These deaths were truly tragic but many of us believe that the word "genocide" should be reserved for deliberate attempts to exterminate an ethnic group. When we examine the facts and acknowledge the amount of lying that has been coming from the Armenian side, it becomes abundantly clear that the events of 1915, tragic as they were, were not a "genocide" as the word is normally understood -anymore than the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, in which hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians were killed or horribly maimed for life, was a genocide. It was not a deliberate attempt to exterminate an ethnic group.
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Posted on February 14 at 2:02 p.m.
Yes Suzy, we understand clearly. When the Armenians agitate for the forgone conclusion of "genocide", spending billions of dollars, circumventing judicial systems and instead pressuring legislators in countries worldwide it's all in the name of "peace, justice and the Armenian Way". But when the Turkish government stands up and defends itself against all this intrigue and deceit it's nothing but corruption ...right?
It was clear enough to me when I read in "zicli's" post: "...your grandparents, some of whom murdered my grandparents, grand aunts, grand uncles relentlessly" that the context and usage was metaphorical and I would expect that a University Student - especially one pursuing an advanced degree would understand it that way also.
Readers of this forum will have to read Suzy's comments and judge for themselves if ethnic hatred is present in her posts. For me the answer is as clear as day. The Armenians of Eastern Anatolia came here almost a century ago in large numbers - refugees from an area that saw some of the most dreadful conflicts of the "Great War" (WW1). Some of them managed to get on with their lives. Others had emotional baggage - unqenched hatreds which they have institutionalized and passed down to their descendants. War is really a terrible thing; it's not all courage and glory as some would have us believe. The problem with the Armenian side in this argument is that it amounts to tunnel vision. They say "Look what happened to my grandparents and my relatives" and refuse do acknowledge the atmosphere in which these terrible events occurred and the seriousness of the provocation. World War 1 has never ended for them.
On Calling for Consistency