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<b>EYEING THE TRIBE:</b>  While working each summer for the tribe from 2003-2005, anthropologist Paul H. Gelles became fascinated with how much casino revenues had boosted the Chumash people’s cultural rebirth; so the Midland teacher spent the next few years researching and writing his academic study of that phenomenon.

Paul Wellman

EYEING THE TRIBE: While working each summer for the tribe from 2003-2005, anthropologist Paul H. Gelles became fascinated with how much casino revenues had boosted the Chumash people’s cultural rebirth; so the Midland teacher spent the next few years researching and writing his academic study of that phenomenon.


Casino Powering Chumash Culture?

Anthropologist Paul H. Gelles Discusses New Book Chumash Renaissance


Thursday, June 20, 2013
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After 200 or so years of subjugation, discrimination, and poverty, it only took about a decade for the Santa Ynez Band of Mission Indians to completely flip the economic and political tables of Santa Barbara County, where they’re now one of the largest employers, a major philanthropic force, and a lobbying heavyweight. Yet because that rise to prominence came on the back of the Chumash Casino ​— ​a large resort opened in 2004 amid much public outcry on the Chumash reservation at the center of the Santa Ynez Valley ​— ​the success story has never been without controversy. And with plans to annex land across Highway 246 for a cultural center, as well as desires to develop the recently purchased 1,400-acre Camp 4 property into tribal housing, the past, present, and future of the Santa Ynez Chumash will be at the forefront of Santa Barbara politics for years to come.

Against that backdrop comes Chumash Renaissance: Indian Casinos, Education, and Cultural Politics in Rural California, a new book from anthropologist Paul H. Gelles. After studying South American tribes and teaching at UC Riverside for many years, Gelles came to live in the Santa Ynez Valley in 2003 when he was hired by the Chumash as a cultural coordinator for their summer camp. He worked in that capacity for two more summers, and then ​— ​in between teaching classes at Midland School, where he remains a teacher ​— ​Gelles spent the ensuing years researching, writing, and self-publishing this first attempt to show how integral casino revenues have been to saving and restoring traditional Chumash culture.

“Chumash culture was there before the casino, obviously, but the casino revenues have helped the tribe revitalize it and even bring things back,” said Gelles, explaining that, among other triumphs, the Chumash hired a linguist to recover and teach them the old Samala language. “It’s so different from where I worked in Peru, where there was a very strong culture with very little money. Here is a tribe that has financial resources to focus on culture and reclaim what has been taken from them.”

“It’s not like I love casinos, but the casino tribes are the only indigenous people out of all the Americas that have gained economic and political power.”

Along with the cultural rebirth has come an educational revolution for the tribe’s 1,200 descendents ​— ​who can tap into college scholarships ​— ​as well as actual political power, too, which Chumash elders wield at local, state, and federal levels in ways that were unimaginable just 20 years ago. “For the 50 million indigenous people from the Americas, probably 98 percent still live in abject poverty and have very little economic or political power,” said Gelles. “It’s not like I love casinos, but the casino tribes are the only indigenous people out of all the Americas that have gained economic and political power.”

While the book looks very favorably on the casino’s impact, Gelles doesn’t give his opinion on future plans, and he agrees that people have a right to oppose development. But he believes that the opposition groups represent a “vocal minority” of mostly “elite, white people” ​— ​many of whom came to the valley in fairly recent times ​— ​and questions their tactics. “What I object to is the way in which they denigrate the tribal members in the process,” said Gelles. “They question authenticity, which is very insulting. It’s very different than what other developments face.”

Gelles believes that’s partly because modern society has trouble reconciling the image of pristine Native Americans with the reality of successful businesspeople. “We like to think of Native Americans as being representative of what we’ve lost as a people,” he said. “We don’t think about the living experience of flesh-and-blood people.” But in his South American research, particularly on a group of Peruvian migrants who traveled regularly between their Andean village and Washington, D.C., Gelles knows that 21st-century success does not wipe out tradition. “What you find are that social mobility and modernity can be compatible with indigenous identity,” he explained.

Gelles mostly hopes his book helps remind his neighbors that they live amid many different kinds of people, not just rich, white ranchers. “I’ve got a 10-year-old and a 7-year-old, and I want them to grow up in a community that respects cultural diversity,” said Gelles. “The public institutions haven’t done a good job of educating people about the diversity that exists in the Santa Ynez Valley. I’m hoping to force a dialogue and discussion about this, and tell what’s largely an untold story.”

Comments

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Gelles is playing the race card. The "anyone who opposes the Casino is a racist" argument isn't going to cut it. Does Gelles know that über-liberal David Crosby is also opposed to the Casino? Since I'm not a mind-reader I can't say for sure that racism doesn't play a part but I can tell you that the main objection to the Casino is the fact that it attracts drunks, meth heads, crime and traffic. Having said that, the group he talks about, The Preservation of Los Olivos, have shown their inconsistency by not going after the metastasizing culture of alcohol that has all but taken over the Santa Ynez Valley in the form of wine bars. I took them to task over this and they defended the wine bars, which have all but totally replaced the art galleries in Los Olivos despite the protests of many of the people who live there.

OK, now that I've offended everybody, let's look at the big picture. Evidently, the ONLY way the Chumash can make money (or at least, so I'm being told) is through gambling, and the only way the rest of the folks in the Santa Ynez Valley can make money is through alcohol. Isn't that great? What a commentary on our culture.

What puzzles me is this: Why is it that Casinos are the only way to compensate the Chumash and other tribes? Couldn't they have been given other businesses to run such as hotels, restaurants, and any of a number of businesses of their choice? Why is it all about gambling? Maybe someone can explain that one to me.

billclausen (anonymous profile)
June 20, 2013 at 1:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Commodification isn't liberation.

Ken_Volok (anonymous profile)
June 20, 2013 at 2:17 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Casino culture means taking money from people, and giving virtually nothing in return. Except cheap thrills and a split second of hope they may hit the big one. Nice foundation to build a culture upon. Chumash charity is recycling dirty money.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 20, 2013 at 9:09 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Quite, Mr Fighter! All these indigenous people have ever done is take, take, take from us poor folks.

typo (anonymous profile)
June 20, 2013 at 9:47 a.m. (Suggest removal)

We are all indigenous cultures.

Interesting exhibit at the Natural History Museum. Chumash culture was segregated into the hereditary ruling class, the working class and the slacker class.

There appeared to be no Chumash ethic the slacker class deserve special treatment or privileges from the other two classes. That is no giving to the takers in their own tribal system. Honorable native tradition. I approve.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 20, 2013 at 10:16 a.m. (Suggest removal)

They question authenticity, which is very insulting." What he means is that the tribe suffers from racial drift into Caucasian-ism, but we are to relate to the tribe as %100 full blooded American Indians. B) There's no proof any tribe is indigenous, that is, developed in N America start to finish. This guy's in the bag for Chumash Inc probably for so much as a free dinner.

Hemlockroid (anonymous profile)
June 20, 2013 at 10:36 a.m. (Suggest removal)

"Indigenous" cultures are welcome to revert to their indigenous lifestyles. Absent any other culture's additions to the ancient purity of their chosen way of life. Though their annual burning of the back country grasslands will need some sort of compromise.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 20, 2013 at 10:57 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Was gambling a part of Chumash tradition?

As a resident of Solvang I can't help but to notice that whenever the Casino gives money to some cause, they make sure to let everyone know it.

Altruism?..or self-promotion? Figure it out.

billclausen (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 12:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Looking at Native American blood lines, the Chumash of today are pretty far removed from original origins and do not carry the cranial features anymore. I grew up in the valley and remember a lovely lady in Los Olivos who had the 'Chumash' forehead and dark coloring. Didn't the last full-blood die in the turn of the century? It is sad the mission period all but wiped out the culture and language, but tacky casino world is not a plus either unless owning hotels and attracting low-life are the goal. California and the 'rancheria' system in tribal land treaties helped make this mess.

flg1969 (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 6:56 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Games of chance are presented as part of the Chumash tradition in the Natural History Museum exhibit. Along with warring against neighboring tribes. The rigid tribal social stratification previously mentioned was also noteworthy. Along annual burning of the back country decimating every living thing in its path and obliterating natural habitats.

Walking gently on this land with peace and charity in their hearts for all, was not exactly the "Chumash culture". In fact, they resembled pretty much what we still see today in the vast majorities of cultures across the globe.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 10:51 a.m. (Suggest removal)

What happened after the Spanish left?

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 11:09 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Northen California had a Russian settlement

Ken_Volok (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 11:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)

bill, the tribes get to have a monopoly on gambling, incidentally because it is illegal here and legal there.. I suppose we could outlaw restaurants and then give the tribes a monopoly on restaurants to give them an advantage :confused: Would that be a better 'commentary' on society?

Of course, the reason they need an advantage is because we destroyed the culture they had and apparently they were doing ok before we got here.

As far as SY Valley producing wine, well, guess what? They're good at it. There are only a few small select regions that make really good wine, and SY Valley happens to be one. People are willing to pay more per acre for good wine grapes than artichokes or brocolli so that is why wine grapes are grown there. It is for the most part a market function.

loonpt (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 12:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)

""Indigenous" cultures are welcome to revert to their indigenous lifestyles." -foofighter

What a bunch of bologna. Ya, why don't they go and try to settle Los Padres National Forest, then migrate to the Big Bear Mountains in a few years? That's right - we don't really live in a free country anymore, you for the most part can't just go out and live in the wild, especially anywhere that is habitable. You can try, but eventually the authorities will probably have you kicked out and will steal your possessions.

Some of you may be interested in a new Documentary called Destiny's Bridge about a tent city in NJ

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2602924/

loonpt (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 12:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)

We should limit the number of restaurants to three because some people overeat.

Ken_Volok (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 12:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

^Not to mention, these people are several generations removed from when they were living their indigenous lifestyles, so it would be difficult if not impossible to return to that lifestyle since they've had to have lost much of the knowledge their ancestors had about this land.

loonpt (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 12:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

loon, you see the point is most of us laugh hilariously at foo's nutty crap, s/he's indeed full of bologna...try to ignore it.
BC, when you wrote "Couldn't they have been given" re. the Chumash that is part of the problem. They are, with limits, a sovereign nation.
I too mourn the boozy culture of StaYnezValley, and the gross Chumash casino fits right in...I have never patronized it, and they have presented some wonderful musicians (BB King etc.). It doesn't matter if gambling was part of indigenous Chumash culture (it likely was). A better issue to take up might be the tribe's desire to take over Camp 4 property AND make it into legally-protected rez land: more casinos and booze!

DrDan (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 1:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Foo: The burning of the back country was a sort of pruning that had practical results. Burn certain areas and later the growth would be improved. It was a very practical move.

For those who feel guilty about how "we" (meaning us bloggers--us PERSONALLY) stole their land, you're welcome to self-deport, and while you're at it, give back every asset you have to them since after all, you stole it.

No, I didn't think so.

And loon, as usual, you miss my point entirely, but given your past defense of the alcohol culture and your insistence that 0.08 is too low a legal blood alcohol content, (despite the fact that I've proven to you it isn't--citing what happened to my dad being hit by a buzzed driver) I'm not the least surprised.

billclausen (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 3:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Sir yes sir!

billclausen (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 6:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Were the Spanish soldiers centuries ago taking women by force the only source for this alleged Chumash racial impurity, or did consensual relationships later also contribute to this dilution of the bloodlines? Sounds a little late to still be playing victim in 2013, spirit walker. Who is teaching you this stuff?

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 9:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)

KV: you might think you were making a joke about limiting restaurants because so many people are now over-weight.

Plan Santa Barbara's section devoted to data management proposed to do just that. Monitoring city residents weight would determine whether new restaurants would be permitted or not. Right in public testimony this was explained to the nodding approval of the then sitting planning commissioners.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 9:26 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Always thought it was odd the name "Indians" was adopted and used by those claiming special entitlement as the nations "first peoples. Talk about cultural impurities. Taking a patently false name imposed by mistaken European explorers never made sense to me. Explain this one to me please, spirit walker.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 21, 2013 at 9:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)

In Russel Means' autobiography "Where White Men Fear To Tread" he states that he will use the term "Indian" as he pleases, and doesn't care what anyone else thinks.

For those not familiar with Russel Means, he was an Oglaga Sioux activist. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russell_...

billclausen (anonymous profile)
June 22, 2013 at 12:36 a.m. (Suggest removal)

The Oglaga Sioux were amongst the first tribes to actively participate in the making of motion pictures at the turn of the 20th century. Thomas Ince contracted them to play themselves, many times re-enacting historical events they had themselves participated in against their actual former adversaries. I.e. at one point, we had "real cowboys and indians". making cowboy and indian pictures.
One of the most successful of the early directors was James Young Deer of the Winnebago tribe.

Ken_Volok (anonymous profile)
June 22, 2013 at 1:16 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Good ethic: cultural purity is doing whatever you want? Okay.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 22, 2013 at 6:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I read Gelles' book and it's excellent. No, he's not in the bag for the Sta. Ynez Chumash and gives a relatively unbiased review of what happened up there after the Spaniards came in. The Inesenos, like Eastern Europe after W.W. I, endured a triple colonization of first the Spaniards (esp. after 1770s), the even worse colonization and extirpation under Mexican colonization in early 1800s, and were pummeled again with the anglos arriving around 1849. Between 1805 - 1852 over 90% disappeared, and Gelles appropriately uses the term "holocaust" for what happened. Other historians writing about Native Americans generally use the term "long genocide".
So much disinformation in many of the above, ranting, near-racist posts. E.g., when loquacious foo stupidly states, "Casino culture means taking money from people, and giving virtually nothing in return" -- a 2008 study by the SB County Tax Payers Assoc. noted "an annual economic stimulus of $336 million" and there is much more [see pp. 155 - 157]. Work on doing some research, foo, no one listens to your logorrhea.
BC you are wrong, and YOU are playing the race card; Gelles does not [read the book, costs $16.95 at Chaucer's]. He gives plenty of attention to David Crosby, who is a pretty nice guy but completely full of BS in this matter. Interestingly, many oldtimers in the Valley don't mind the Chumash expansion, but the Hollywood left, the rockstars and Elton John's manager [Taupin] and other recent LA refugees are leading this ridiculous fight againt the Chumash.
Gelles is also very honest about the "fee-to-trust" process. I am very supportive of the Chumash renaissance, and have taught a few Chumash students at my school (wonderful students!), but I do wonder if they should get to make the enormous Camp 4 property actually part of their reservation. Why can't that area simply be developed by them, residential, and following county rules?
Thank you for a fine book, Mr. Gelles.

DrDan (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 4:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Fact: The government contract that allows gambling requires indian casinos to pay for the negative impacts generated to the surrounding communities.

This is not "putting money back into the local economy". It is a required reimbursement and needs to be identified as such ; not trotted out as acts of casino charitable munificence.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 4:35 p.m. (Suggest removal)

BTW: I like that term "blogarrhea". Assume it is in the public domain for others to use, with equal relish.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 4:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

So the Chumash hire someone to investigate and write about their casino / culture, and it turns out to be a puff piece.

Surprise!!!

One thing to consider re. this article is that the Independent makes considerable ad revenue from the Chumash Casino. Don't hold your breath for any real investigative reporting.

SamRedDog (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 5:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)

As a type of sovereign nation within our federal republic, all legally recognized Native American tribes (including Sta Ynez Chumash tribe, recognized 1901) have a much different relationship to all US government agencies than other groups who have immigrated here (legally or not).
I read the 207 page, carefully annotated book by Gelles, it isn't a puff piece. Have you found time to read it, SamRedDog?
Gelles gives several pages to community and local criticisms of the Samala people [pp150 - 158], including seven important headings, and we've seen these criticisms and attacks in most of the posts above [esp foo and BC].
Great book.

DrDan (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 5:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)

DrDan: Please tell me (and all who follow this thread) how I am playing the race card.

billclausen (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 6 p.m. (Suggest removal)

You were not bc. Remember, if you disagree with anything on the left you are a racist, a misogynist, a bigot, or assbackwards. Let it go.

italiansurg (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 6:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Letter to the NewsPress today from two identified Coastal Chumash who pointed out they have been denied "Casino Chumash" status, and wish some of the Casino Chumash largesse would flow their way in this alleged Casino Chumash community largesse. They also are ticked the Casino Chumash do their sage purifications on their coastal land and then drive off leaving them with nary a penny. Who knew.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 6:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Bill you were the first to mention race writing at the top of your first post, "Gelles is playing the race card." Since I read the book, and G. isn't, and you haven't read the book, it felt like you introduced this aspect in the beginning without much info. Why did you bring it up? What was your point?
You display astounding naivete when asking, rhetorically I'd guess, "Evidently, the ONLY way the Chumash can make money" is via the casino. Do you understand, really, what happened to this indigenous tribe under the triple colonization? A slow genocide with 90% dying in less than 50 years? The absolutely un-level playing field, the lack of education, good jobs, an opportunity to find better work?? Then you ask innocently about, oh, only through the casino?
Maybe your real point, one you often make, is sadness and regret that "the metastasizing culture of alcohol [that] has all but taken over the Santa Ynez Valley in the form of wine bars." Well, that is very sad, I agree with you, but don't hold it against the Chumash and the casino, they did not create that!
And they have diversified, they own gas stations and a very large hotel in Solvang and... read the book. The tribe is the second fastest growing employer in SB Count; the over 1500 employees average more than $40,000 @ year earnings...and so on. Get some more facts.
and italian, you mention "racist, a misogynist, a bigot, or assbackwards" as leftist traits, but BC brought up the race card himself, the Chumash-haters are the misogynists, bigotry is all over the place, and as you well know "left" here is "center" in Europe. How do you like fitting into your extreme rightwing positions, eh? Fess up, you admire the modern Chumash who are working the corporate capitalism thing very well.

DrDan (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 7:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)

it makes sense you read the News-Suppress, foo, which could print such letters in the full knowledge that only the Sta Ynez branch of the Chumash has the federal definition of an official Native American tribe [1901]. If that is wrong, blame the feds, not the Chumash. And why wouldn't there be intra-tribal squabbles? You subscribe to the old "noble savage" BS where they are supposed to be laconic, long-suffering, and penniless, these proud Native Americans aren't that way, and what a good thing.These are people, like all others in most ways, and they will have there issues, of course.

DrDan (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 7:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)

NewsFlash: exploiting sin sells.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 8:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The Old DeMille formula: 90 minutes of sin, 10 minutes of salvation.

Ken_Volok (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 10:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Me noble savage, you poor sucker.

Ken_Volok (anonymous profile)
June 23, 2013 at 10:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)

"Bill you were the first to mention race writing at the top of your first post, 'Gelles is playing the race card.' Since I read the book, and G. isn't, and you haven't read the book, it felt like you introduced this aspect in the beginning without much info. Why did you bring it up? What was your point?"
-DrDan
June 23, 2013 at 7:44 p.m.-

If you read the quote below, excerpted from the above article quoting Gelles, you will see that it was he who brought race into this issue.

"Gelles doesn’t give his opinion on future plans, and he agrees that people have a right to oppose development. But he believes that the opposition groups represent a 'vocal minority' of mostly 'elite, white people' ” 

I also remember that c.2006, a petition was passed around the valley opposing Casino expansion. They needed 3000 votes. They (The POLO people) said they got close to 12000. That quite a "vocal minority"

Also, yes DrDan, I do understand what happened to the Chumash who were here when the Europeans came. I suppose *your* reference to that was rhetorical? But you see, that's not the issue, the issue is *why* must the only way for one to profit be at the expense of others? If you're a true progressive/liberal, then aren't you for *everybody* doing well, and not some people profiting at the expense of the quality of life of others? But of course, your anger toward me gets you off the issue, and I obviously have refuted you by point out who brought up the race issue.

You also make false statements about Bernie Taupin being Elton John's manager. Taupin is in fact, Elton John's lyricist. His managers are listed in the following link: http://www.rocketmusic.com/?page=arti...

DrDan: What your comments typify is pseudo-liberalism, not the "peace" "love" and "equality" definition of liberalism with which I grew up. I have dared to question the way things are being done, and of you respond with more divisive elitist hyperbole.

What I dared to ask--and in the politically correct world you espouse--any questioning is met with personal attacks--is why (seemingly) the only way one can profit in the Valley is through booze and gambling. Did you read my comment to see I was also equally criticizing the wine businesses which are supported by those who oppose the Casino?

In short, I don't have a problem with the Chumash making unlimited amounts of money; I merely asked if there are other ways Indian/Native American/First People (or whatever term is politically correct because the rules keep changing) or for that matter, anyone else could prosper without depositing drunk motorists on the roads. And yes, I'm not afraid to call people on playing the race card, as the author has done, or calling you out for not getting your facts straight.

And you are an educator?

billclausen (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 3:52 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Geez bc, haven't I told you to ignore them and maybe they will go away? You fell right into their trap by addressing completely specious attacks; now you're in the middle of friggin' debate when in fact you should have just let them continue to dig their myopic little hole. You and I could have popped a couple of brewski's and watched them meltdown...
I believe DD is an "eduKator".

italiansurg (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 6:41 a.m. (Suggest removal)

BC you plaintively ask "the issue is *why* must the only way for one to profit be at the expense of others?" lt's called corporate capitalism, unregulated and sliding back to the sordid 1880s.
I stated I agreed with you about the booze culture growing in the Valley, you read that wrong, and it's very sad.
Thank you for the correction about Taupin, lyricist is much more important than manager, but in terms of the elitist sorts moving to SYV it doesn't matter.
When you reference POLO approvingly, ha, Bill, you have nothing. And I did not insult you, just said you show a lot of naivete about Chumash economic development asking "why must the only way for one to profit be at the expense of others?" <--THIS is not the issue, Bill, and it's a red herring. Your attitude shows clearly when you write "Couldn't they have been given other businesses to run " --"give them" really nice.

DrDan (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 6:45 a.m. (Suggest removal)

'remember, italian, BC doesn't "pop brewski's" with his myopic view of what's happening to the SY Valley...but KV & I enjoyed our Hurricane Deck IP out on the slopes of Figueroa Mtn., wonderful, esp for an edukator like me. You should try kicking back yourself sometime, then you won't fall into "their trap"? Uh, who are "they" again?

DrDan (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 8:06 a.m. (Suggest removal)

When people sell what other people want, they are not profiting "at the expense of others". They are offering value in fair exchange for renumeration.

Chumash are selling momentary cheap thrills which they alone provide locally due to a cushy exclusive federal fiat, and are getting paid handsomely in exchange. Is this profiteering "at the expense of others?

Not if one values paying for cheap thrills and watching the bulk of their own money put on the table go to the house.

The downside of course is if the state is then required to step in to provide services for those who gambled away the milk money, and left their families in a state of poverty. Then the Chumash are knowingly taking dirty money off the table; and all bets are off.

Such are the wages of sin.

foofighter (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 9:19 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I received the following from Peter Peli:

Mr. Volok...you were doing just fine with your argument regarding your feelings about the Chumash..but when you do "Red-face"; impressions & "Me noble savage", you cross a thin line & show your true self. I find you to be a coward.

Ken_Volok (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 12:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Yes, I said it & will say it again...Ken V. is a blatant coward. It requires a coward & a snitch to attempt to gain support for his racist comment of "Me noble savage". As I originally stated, his argument was just fine up to that point. You only serve to prove my opinion of you by running to this comment section [aka Mommy] to tell everyone "Look what he said"....Boo-Hoo.

PeterPeli (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 1:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I don't appreciate Nazis, PC or Tea Party sending me stupid little hate messages as if I'd grovel to be forgiven.
Cowards bow to censorship, even worse advocate it. Who is the real racist Mr. Peli? Look in the mirror before you answer because I assure you, you will only look stupid if not worse attacking me.

Ken_Volok (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 1:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I took KV's "me noble savage" in a sarcastic vein, at the edge of appropriate, and he was responding to crazed foo posting a sarcastic NewsFlash: "exploiting sin sells". So if we're gonna have Elmer Gantry, why not irony off the Noble Savage, Peli?
And it's on topic since I was asking BC "who is real racist?" since he brought up the term about Gelles' book first, and had not asserted he'd read the book or gave any quotes...maybe he's read it now, eh, Bill?

DrDan (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 1:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)

DrDan: I've made my points, you've made yours. No point rehashing what's already been said.

billclausen (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 2:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

With that let's enjoy some early Native American filmmaking, James Young Deer's "White Fawn's Devotion"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jSo0p...

Ken_Volok (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 3:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)

More power to the Chumash of SYV. As far as I can tell, they took the cards they were dealt and did the most with it.

Not all are so fortunate however. I've been to the Navajo reservation east of the Grand Canyon and the residents there live in abject poverty.

EastBeach (anonymous profile)
June 24, 2013 at 9:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Now I get it KV, you alone created the nut job alter ego PeterPeli as a foil to your logical points of view. By foisting a typically unintellectual and knee jerk reaction to all things Native American against your humor and reason, you are more able to make your point to a broader audience.
PeterPeli, I salute your ignorance and stupidity!
KV, thanks for dreaming up this wacky character!

italiansurg (anonymous profile)
June 25, 2013 at 6:48 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Quite the opposite "Italian"...KV & you are one & the same, easily recognizable by the name calling & tears in your response. I accept your salute as a sign of surrender.

PeterPeli (anonymous profile)
June 27, 2013 at 12:16 p.m. (Suggest removal)

these are now the bi-polar thread wars of Santa Barbara County, bridges to greater understanding across the same brain stem (corpos collosum?). Drone assassinations = Peace. Italian = KV. BC = Dan. Wow. Smarmyageddon.

DrDan (anonymous profile)
June 27, 2013 at 2:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Everybody is Shirley MacLaine except Warren Beatty.

Ken_Volok (anonymous profile)
June 27, 2013 at 2:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)

"I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together. " (From the Beatles' song I am the walrus)

Therefore I am Ken Volok, and I am DrDan, Peter Peli and all the rest.

billclausen (anonymous profile)
June 27, 2013 at 3:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)


Quite the opposite "Italian"...KV & you are one & the same, easily recognizable by the name calling & TEARS in your response. I accept your salute as a sign of surrender.

PeterPeli (anonymous profile)
June 27, 2013 at 12:16 p.m.

"I'm crying" (Also from I am the walrus)

It all is starting to make sense to me now.

billclausen (anonymous profile)
June 27, 2013 at 3:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)

"I contain multitudes!" -- Walt Whitman, I'd guess?

DrDan (anonymous profile)
June 27, 2013 at 3:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Mama Mia!

Ken_Volok (anonymous profile)
June 27, 2013 at 3:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)

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