Middle-Aged Concert-Goers Behaving Badly

I find the latecomers really annoying, regardless of age. At UCSB, they seem to start the shows late to accommodate latecomers -- I wish they'd start right on time and quit enabling these inconsiderate people. I guess they think everyone is on "santa barbara time".

I agree with you, I was there on time, in fact to great effort to be there on time, and the late comers kept making us get up. We also had to get up for the people who wanted to go get a beer every half hour and the lady next to me proceeded to get drunk and talk my ear off while I was trying to listen to the performances! Then there were the people behind us who were yelling at each other and the ones that stole other people's seats. In fact, there were a lot of people in wrong seats or who would take people's seats when they did go to get their umpteenth beer so when they came back there were arguments. It's just rude! Fortunately the concert was good regardless and Bonnie was a kick! :)

Guy, you're at a concert, what do you expect? Don't like it? Stay home and listen to your music in peace!

We went to the Bowl for the first time in a couple of years (last one was Bonnie Raitt in 2007) to see the Killers the next night and sat in the back section figuring that we'd be out of the commotion. About the same level of behavior as down in front. Unfortunately for us we were the second row up from the aisle going across and the constant stream of people going to and from their seats distracted us all during the opening act and all through the Killers, which was an incredible show. What I don't get is virtually no one gets up to walk out/in in the middle of a show at the Lobero, Campbell Hall etc. How come the Bowl?

Rudeness is a national disease, the natural outcome of the 60's generation passing their self-involved ways on to their offspring. I support this writer's views completely. Last thing I want to see at a concert is someone's large rear end "dancing" in front of my face or the music overpowered by loudmouths conversing behind me.

And to ilovesb09, 'Guy, your're at a concert. sit down, shut up, and enjoy the performance. That's what we paid to see, not your own selfish and rude antics. If you want to dance, go to a club.

I recall during the 1970s attending a number of fantastic performances at the Music Center in Los Angeles. The tickets were printed with the words, "No one will be seated during the performance." If one arrived late one gained the privilege of mulling around the lobby until intermission when they would then be allowed to take their seat. You can bet that ninety-nine percent of the seats were filled when the curtain rose. This policy enforces decorum, and establishes who is in charge, right from the get go.

At least give a good tip to the people selling the drinks, as they do not get paid a wage but only work for tips to keep the Bowl patrons drinking and vomiting.

This is America...everyone is ENTITLED to do whatever the $%!@ they want, right? Whenever, wherever.

On the other hand, in "Marat-Sade" the inmates were in charge of the asymlum...

Go figure.

Thanks for writing this piece.

Sounds like someone has outgrown the concert-going stage.

Hey Chuck!

My girlfriend attended this event with one of her female friends

1> Did not smoke (I agree smoking is OFFENSIVE)
2> Had 2 glasses of wine
3> Did not have or witness anyone trying to have sex at the show
4> Wanted to dance, but was strongly encouraged by other stick in the muds like you to sit down... ever been to a show Chuck? a football game? people get excited... it's not the Symphony!

Tried to have a good time - but the audience overall seemed to be a HUGE DUD...

IE: people like you who were expecting a night filled with ballads and keeping your hands folded on your lap.

Get up and have some fun in life... Or realize that you are past the concert going stage. I hear they have some POPS program regularly broadcast on KCET that could probably fit the bill for you just fine.

Performers enjoy the audience being engaged and participating. This was an adult event and adults are allowed to have fun also.

When I pay for a seat at a performance, I expect to see the performance - of the person(s) who appear on the ticket! NOT all the people who think I'd love to experience their interpretations of the performance. YOU buy the CD and rock out in your own residence. YOU vomit in your own toilet bowl - not the County Bowl.

Policing the world is a full time job. Must be exhausting for you!

When I go to concerts, I tend to stay in my seat, but I don't begrudge others the right to dance, to arrive late, to get up and go get another drink or more food, etc. I can still hear the music, can I not? It's not like I'm trying to watch a movie where I need to hear each word of the dialogue to know what is going on. And can you imagine how the musician would feel at that kind of concert if no one was dancing, no one was expressing any reaction to her music? She would likely think the audience didn't like it, was not engaged, etc. It wasn't a symphony...

I do wonder why you single out the middle-aged and their "flabby arms". Are you, perhaps, bigoted toward people of a certain age? Would a 25 year old with "flabby arms" have been less offensive to your delicate sensibilities?

And here all this time I had thought _I_ was a fuddy duddy for NOT getting up and dancing at concerts. Heck, I've got NOTHING on you or on the majority of the people who posted comments here.

The bowl holds over 4500 people. Yes, a few will drink too much, talk too loud, be rude, show PDAs. Some people see only the negative, I guess.

By the way, are you the Dr. Lepkowski of Solvang, perhaps?

Read the fourth paragraph from a previous Independent article. It seems the County Bowl is more than happy to encourage this behavior.

By the way, kudos to John Locke for having the backbone to call out the problem for what it is. Osolaplaya also made a good comment and to answer tequepistrail's question with a question of my own: Do they serve alcohol at the Lobero, and if so, is it as much as at the Bowl?

Conversely, I don't know what David Pritchett means by saying that if people tip better the problems described would not be as bad. Perhaps he could elaborate on that because I'm missing something there.

Oh, here is the article to which I refer

http://www.independent.com/news/2009/aug...

All the above says why we don't go to the Bowl.

I will never miss a Bonnie Raitt concert at the Bowl as her music affects me to my very center . Saturday nights performance was perhaps her finest ever at the Bowl , accomplished a night after having played The Greek Theater in L.A. in front of a crowd Taj described as " a bunch of fat fish sittin at the bottom of the pond " . Who wants to hear the people behind or next to you gabbing about dumb s_ _ t while Bonnie is singng Angel From Montgomery solo ? And cant you self absorbed people survive 3 hours without your cell/ Blackberry ?

I agree with Beachlivin (I'm the girlfriend who went to the concert) and MichelleR. It was a "rock" concert and the lead act, the very talented and beautiful Ms. Bonnie Raitt, walked out on stage and said she was going to "rock the house." As a singer I know that you get your energy from the crowd. Expecting people to sit down during a rocking song when the star of the show is yelling into the microphone...this is when you can get up and dance...is very unrealistic. Life is about joy and rock concerts are for people who want to en-joy themselves. Who are you to say how someone should express themselves? Loosen up a bit, crack a smile for God's sake and enjoy life a little. Move your ass, clap your hands...it really isn't all so darn serious. If you want serious, read a news paper. If you go to a rock concert...try having fun, you might like it. Bonnie Raitt, you were amazing and we were dancing for YOU!!!!!

Thanks Chuck, for the very insightful article and accurate observations. It's about time someone spoke up. I found most of your comments and suggestions to be fair and helpful.

As a volunteer usher for the past 9 years, and working between 15 and 25 concerts each year, I probably have had more opportunity to regularly observe the kind of behavior you cite, and that readers here have commented on. I also usher at the Arlington as well as attend shows at the Lobero and SoHo.

Your point about showing up late is a great place to start and your comments are 100% on the mark. Late arrival and seating is indeed disrespectful, annoying, and inconsiderate, especially if your seat is right in the middle of a row and you have to stumble past 10 or 15 people to get there.

And when you buy a ticket, it is for a specific seat, not the one in the row behind or two seats down from the one with your number on it, or for any random seat you take a liking to, such as those nice wicker ones in the "founders" section just to the rear of the "floor". We really do make an effort try to show, or at least direct, each patron or group to their actual seats. It's always great fun for us to take someone to their seat only to discover you're sitting in it, and it's 10 seats from the aisle, the show has started, the sun has set and it's dark and we have to climb in front of everyone to check your ticket and get you to the right seat.

As for dancing and having fun - yeah, I agree that's why you spent your money for that ticket, got all dressed up, headed up to the amazing Santa Barbara Bowl, threw back a couple of beers, and stumbled to your seats. But, MichelleR, just maybe the guy behind you, who also paid good money, would like to SEE the show as well as HEAR it. And he has as much right to sit there and soak it in as you do to move with it. So at least cut him a little slack and maybe sit out every other number so he can enjoy the experience as well. Down in the lower "floor" section of the bowl there is even a "dance" area off to the left side where you can shake your booty to your heart's content.

And, I would also suggest that if you're the guy behind, let her "get down" - at least for awhile - before you go ballistic. After all, just because you're not feelin' it doesn't mean it's not there.

"my2cents", I partially agree with you, about it's crazy to expect people to sit down during a "rocking song" (and there were certainly many of those at the Bonnie and Taj show), but "Angel from Montgomery" wasn't one, and to stand up and sway side to side blocking the view of the person behind who wants to see the singer's expression, watch her fingers on the guitar strings, as well as hear the words is just plain inconsiderate. And I've seen just that happen many times over. As you said yourself, "Who are you to say how someone should express themselves?"

On the other hand, if you come to next month's Blink 182 concert, and are bothered when there aren't any seats in the general admission "floor" area and you have to stand for 3 hours, or if you've got a seat in the upper sections and everyone in front of you is standing and dancing all night long, or if you're bothered by the smell of burning "herb" and occasional puddles of vomit, then you didn't do your homework and you should have stayed home.

mrpgeep, thank you for your permission to dance occassionally, but had you actually read what I wrote, you would see that I said, "When I go to concerts, I tend to stay in my seat, but I don't begrudge others the right to dance..." So, even though I do now have your permission, I will continue to sit it out the whole time, but I won't demand that my fellow concert goers do the same. It's an outdoor concert, for heaven's sake, not a symphony in a formal concert hall. Yes, sometimes, my fellow concert goers annoy me, but I figure that is the price I pay for going to a public venue. If I want to be sure to not be annoyed by my fellow humans, I'd best stay home alone.

What a bunch of rude, lawbreaking individuals we have here! It costs a lot to go to the Bowl for a show, and anyone who smokes pot or whatever it is, and anyone who talks all the time so you can't hear, and falls all over you as they pass in front of you to get alcohol ruins the concert for the person who enjoys music in an outdoor setting. I have been going to the Bowl for a long time, and it is getting much worse. I really hate to read the comments to stay at home if you are bothered so much just because a bunch of privileged rude people feel it is their right to party like they were in their own living rooms! I think they should download a concert video instead and leave the place to the people who want to hear the concert artists, not the audience.

Perhaps the Bowl could designate zones. If you want to buy a seat in zone Q, you may smoke, puke, stand up, dance, and fall down, talk as much and as loud as you want during the performance, have sex (sorta), fart, walk back and forth past other audience members and curse them out.

But if you buy a seat in zone P, you agree to be considerate of the others around you, and not distract from the show you and other audience members have paid a lot of money and taken time and effort to come and enjoy. Have a drink, smile, laugh and clap freely, move around when it's called for, but understand you are at an expensive concert, not a free-for-all.

The Bowl is a place to enjoy the music, have a few drinks and party...everybody knows this. If you don't like this type of atmosphere, then, perhaps this venue is not for you. But I feel that all three activites can be enjoyed conscientiously, without being rude to those around you. I'm constantly amazed at the ridiculous behaviour of concert goers at all SB venues; generally speaking, the constant phone ringing, chatting and, over all, self absorption of these people make, what might have been a killer evening, not so enjoyable. Can't we all just get along?

first of all, if the bowl did not pack people into seats like sardines, a lot of these problems could be avoided. I'm sure everyone of you, like myself, have experienced showing up to find your seats occupied and having to ask people to move only to find that there ain't enough room because some people are fat. The bowl does not allow for fat people, as other venues with arm rests on the chairs at least give you the same space as everyone else in the building.
As for the smokers, I find them much less offensive than the alcohol consumers who spill their liquids on people because of their intoxication, or just because it is so difficult to maneuver to their seat because the bowl packs people in LIKE SARDINES. My shoes still have the wine stain they suffered at the No Doubt show. Alcohol stinks much more than smoke when your clothes have been soiled by it.

The dancers : keep on dancing! If you want to sit on your butt, stay home and rent the concert dvd. I nor anyone else should have to curb our enthusiasm (at a rock show for ****** sake!) for some wet blanket who is too affraid or self conscious to let loose every now and again. The money we put up for these shows is too expensive to not participate and get a little exercise. Hey, it would be good for the fat people taking up two seats when they only paid for one. Maybe some people are late because of the hike up the hill? Maybe because the concerts start way too early, so you have to go straight from work, skip dinner and some reasonable down time? Could it be that 10pm curfew that performers abide by, forcing the early start time? hmmmm. Plus, what genius designer rid the bowl of the lawn and put in concrete? Such a shame....

Thanks to everyone who commented on my letter. In response to some comments and inquiries: 1) The "flabby arms" reference was not intended as an age- or gender-related comment. It was directed at the specific concert-goers who waved their arms in front of me and those around me throughout most of the Bonnie Raitt concert. They were of both genders, and they were younger than I am. Their arms were, however, flabby, which made it even more challenging to see through or around them. 2) One's expectations of concert behavior really do depend on the artist (cf. mrgeep's comment about the Blink 182 concert). The Bonnie Raitt crowd is (for the most part) not the Blink 182 crowd. I would not dream of complaining about people standing up and dancing at a Blink 182 concert. Going to a Bonnie Raitt concert, however, one does not generally expect to be in the mosh pit. 3) It is not my place to pass judgment on anybody for wanting to have a good time. The point I was hoping to convey is this: Regardless of the venue, making others uncomfortable is not okay; and disregarding their requests to stop making them uncomfortable is rude. 4) The inspiration for my letter, truly, was the standing, dancing, necking, smoking person who, when asked for the umpteenth time by the person behind her (not me, BTW) to please sit down, told him "F**k Off." I can't imagine a context in which that is appropriate behavior. Can't we all just get along? Of course. All it takes is a little common courtesy.

Right ON!!!!! That's why I NEVER go to the Bowl anymore. I've had it. The only dignified place these days is the Lobero. Boorish behavior is evident at the Arlington as well.

Excellent. Well done.

You sound like a Chuck Lepkowski I once knew.

If you are, in fact, the FJB from UCD, please google your former roommate, ex-firefighter. Use my name followed by Riverside, California. Then call my office to make contact. We will be coming to Santa Barbara frequently over the next four years, and would enjoy discussing the city, porcupines, and similar interesting topics.

If you're not this guy...

never mind.

I have been hearing, from my Montecito bedroom with all the doors to my home closed, the West Beach music concert for hours and hours. I have had a headache for a day and a half prior to this. Were I Dr. Charles Michael Lepkowsky of Solvang, or many of the people commenting here, I would be, what, calling the police? Perhaps. I can ONLY hope that there is no one over 35 waving their "flabby arms" or, god forbid!, dancing! 'Cause, god knows, people paid for the right to be at that beach! And, hey, I paid for my right to be in this house!

Oh, fuddy duddy, thy name is (see above...)

"middle-aged men and women at the Bonnie Raitt concert who repeatedly stood up and waved your flabby arms in the air in front of other people" -Chuck Lepkowsky-

We can't have that, can we? This thirteen-second educational video shows the sort of people we need to have attending these concerts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHZhw94C5...

<sigh> I hereby formally retract the "flabby arms" comment. If anyone would like to comment on the main point -- civility -- I would be more interested in hearing about that.

doctorx: Why is being a doctor (assuming you are one, and assuming you are the author of the article) relevant to this story?

People who sign their names affixed with man-made titles are being pretentious unless their title pertains to the subject at hand. (e.g., a P.h.D. of English Literature making a point about Shakespeare)

Ironically, I agree with you that people should be better behaved at concerts and in public.

Bill Clausen. H.S.G. (High School Graduate)

Who needs a doctor when you have me, The Profit.

Bill Clausen,

"doctorx" is a joke nickname I have used as an idenitifier for years. Please note that I did not include or refer to a title in my byline or elsewhere (although apparently someone else making comments thought it was important enough to mention twice). I agree, it is totally irrelevant to this story -- accordingly, I did not make mention of it.

Titles are overrated.

Sounds like you think everyone should have Symphony behavior at the Bowl, huh?

Forget it, it won't happen. Never has. Never will.

Get over yourself already.

Obviously, you're not a regular attendee at the Bowl. I've been to ~40 shows over the last 7yrs or so and sure, sometimes I find myself wishing the group in front of me would sit down for a while... etc., etc... but it is that kind of venue and that kind of show. For you to dictate decorum of others based on age or any other ridiculous criteria you alone decide - that's just wrong. Everyone paid to go to the show. They can enjoy it however they see fit. There is not a "No Dancing" policy at the bowl, where do you think you are... the midwest in the 50's?

There are limits to acceptable behavior at the bowl and Security deals within those rules more than you obviously realize. Spilling beer accidentally while navigating through a crowd is to be expected, but only being overly drunk and obnoxious will get you tossed - and that will get one tossed too. Dancing and having a good time is not on the verbotten list, kind doctor... so either get used to the fact that you do not dictate behavior for the entire venue or stay home next time.

To cartoonz and others who have commented to the effect that I "dictate behavior for the entire venue," please take the time to read the entire article.

I did not condemn dancing, drinking, or partying. During the later part of the concert in question, I did in fact stand and dance. The point of the article was simply Please Don't Offend Other People.

I hope that the Independent will publish some new opinion pieces, so that we can move on from what has deteriorated into a tiresome, ad hominem process.

Where do I fit in in all of this?

I know how to read, Chuck... and your entire article does indeed attempt to "dictate behavior for the entire venue".

You spell out all of the the "bad behaviors" by others that you find so egregiously offensive and expect everyone else to just step to your tune of proper behavior.

"Proper behavior" for concert goers from your viewpoint is obviously not the same as the rest of the crowd, so either learn to deal with it or stay home.

Don't get me wrong, I truly do know exactly how you feel and I've wished on may occasions that people would not do some of the things you mentioned... but I also realized a long time ago that they are going to do it regardless of my wishes, so my best approach is to "live and let live" and have the best time I can, rather than get completely stuck and pissed off - that will only leave you feeling the way you do now. Getting stuck in negativity isn't healthy, right Doc?